Reddit reviews 1491 (Second Edition): New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus

I highly recommend 1491 to anyone that wants to read more, specifically about the depopulation of the new world in the first years of contact, and generally about new world people before and just after contact. Fantastic book.

The episode that stands out most notably in my mind was exploration of Hernando de Soto, who led the first European expedition deep into the interior of the continent. He actually went some distance up the Mississippi River and recorded large populations of natives living in cities. By the time the next European made it that far, the cities and culture and almost the entire population of the "Mississippians" had simply been obliterated. The few people left had reverted back to hunting and gathering and what little we know about the civilization of their antecedents is from what we can dig out of the ground.

1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus by Charles Mann is a great read. It's astounding how little we know about the nations and civilizations that occupied and shaped the Americas before Europeans arrived. Great cities with amazing architecture and infrastructure, science and agriculture on a massive scale, but also wars and slavery, and sometimes human sacrifice. People are people.

https://www.amazon.ca/1491-Second-Revelations-Americas-Columbus-ebook/dp/B000JMKVE4

Have you read 1491? It's a few years old now and isn't just about the Inca, but it's a good start. https://www.amazon.com/1491-Second-Revelations-Americas-Columbus-ebook/dp/B000JMKVE4/

Highly recommend 1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus.

Incredibly well researched and goes into great depth about the pre-Colombus histories of the varying distinct American regions (the Andes, Mexico and the Yucatan peninsula, the Great Plains tribes of North America specifically).

Every tribe was different, many of the eastern tribes did have permanent cities and complex agriculture. The tribes that settled in our region didn't do a lot of permanent agriculture, but they definitely managed buffalo herds with some sophistication.

According to Charles Mann's 1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus, pre-Columbus plains Indians actually created and maintained healthy grazing grassland through controlled burning, and carefully regulated the bison population.

According to Mann, the huge "seas" of tens of thousands of bison that white settlers reported were actually the result of out-of-whack ecosystem, after European disease epidemics decimated the populations of the Plains tribes.

So it wasn't "ranching" in the way that we know it today, but it was definitely intentional herd management and cultivation of the land, not just disorganized nomadic hunting.

I really like 1491 and 1493. Anything that smashes this revisionist history thing we've got going in the US.

Sure here: http://www.amazon.com/1491-Second-Edition-Revelations-Americas-ebook/dp/B000JMKVE4 & you can learn a little here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1491:_New_Revelations_of_the_Americas_Before_Columbus#Reception

The book is worth a read it aggragates many peer-reviewed scientific studies. Much of the disease on the continet arrived before Columbus the native people were already in a biological disaster due to disease. Migratory animals spread smallpox before Columbus arrived. It actually makes perfect sense when you stop and think about it. Still don't take my word for for it, it's in a book take a look reading rainbow.

Charles C Mann, here's a link on Amazon

That's exactly it. The excellent book 1491 really rams that home (also I'm guessing we both got the idea from that book or the research it cites.)

All three of these diets are loosely true for various areas and periods of human history.

1. Hunter gatherer societies did eat lots of meat and foraged plants. This has generally been better for human health (the archaeological record shows us that the adoption of agriculture coincided with larger, less healthy populations). However, frankly this idea ignores all the historical and environmental context of hunter-gatherer societies. The hunter-gatherer diet requires a small, stable population. It can't support larger populations. Anyway, the point is moot because we don't really know what the paleo diet was, and the hunter-gatherer diet is completely unsustainable on a large scale.
   
2. As far as raw vegan diets...not sure. Are you sure you described raw veganism correctly? I'm not very familiar with it. AFAIK ancient veganism has been sporadic and largely confined to Greek philosophers and India? Not terribly certain on this point.
   
3. Your descriptions are pretty vague, but #3 is especially vague. Which humans when? Potatoes and corn only existed in the New World until extremely recently in human history, though they were both extremely important to many Central and South American civilizations. I'm not so sure about rice but I don't think it was consumed outside of Asia for most of history?
   
   If you're really wondering who is right or wrong, I think what's important to take away here is that humans haven't had one diet throughout our evolutionary history. Different diets have been necessary/possible in different environments, and changed depending on population needs etc. I highly suggest reading An Edible History of Humanity if you really want to get into it (which, along with 1491, is my source for this response).
   
   Apologies if I've gotten any facts wrong.

1491 by Charles Mann discusses pre-Columbus America.

I highly recommend the book 1491. It goes over a lot of the questions you are asking.

OP means 1491. It is non-fiction historical/archaeological. It's a really good read. One of the books that really reframes you concept of the world. Just to clarify

A good place to start might be Charles Mann's 1491 https://www.amazon.com/1491-Second-Revelations-Americas-Columbus-ebook/dp/B000JMKVE4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1511968556&sr=8-1&keywords=1491

The enviornmental effects were minor relative to the columbian exchange.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2002/03/1491/302445/
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JMKVE4/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1

The Native Americans has massively intervened and changed the natural environment. Then, basically, the vast bulk of them died, long before the english colonies got past the Mississippi. Their dying led to the collapse of their created ecosystem, which was simulateously feeling the effects of a massive invasion of plants and animals from Europe/Asia/Africa. This collapse led to a chaotic realignment of species in north and south america, and a fundamental change in ecosystems.

I originally read about it here: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JMKVE4/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1

On terra preta specifically: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terra_preta

Other links: https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/pristine-untouched-amazonian-rainforest-was-actually-shaped-humans-180962378/

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b0122njp

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/science-news/3350474/Amazon-rainforest-was-giant-garden-city.html

Cool. This book is pretty good: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JMKVE4/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1

Excellent reference: https://www.amazon.com/1491-Second-Revelations-Americas-Columbus-ebook/dp/B000JMKVE4/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1503783789&sr=8-1&keywords=1491

I highly suggest you educate yourself before you talk.

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https://www.amazon.com/Peoples-History-United-States/dp/0060838655

https://www.amazon.com/1491-Second-Revelations-Americas-Columbus-ebook/dp/B000JMKVE4

https://www.amazon.com/Florentine-Codex-Conquest-General-History/dp/1607811677