We found 17 Reddit comments about Iron John: A Book About Men. Here are the top ones, ranked by their Reddit score.
Keep powering on young man! You don't have to be successful to be great. Life's greatest challenges are picking yourself up again after falling down. And you seem to be doing that really well.
Can I recommend a book to you? It's called Iron John. It's an easy ready, but it's designed to help people find strength in themselves. Don't rush though it! Take each chapter slowly and think about it from your own perspective.
Edit: link to paperback on Amazon: less than $6 after shipping
A few, in no particular order:
The Way of the Superior Man: A Spiritual Guide to Mastering the Challenges of Women, Work, and Sexual Desire
Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion (Collins Business Essentials)
Mastering Your Hidden Self: A Guide to the Huna Way (A Quest Book)
My Secret Garden: Women's Sexual Fantasies
Introducing NLP: Psychological Skills for Understanding and Influencing People (Neuro-Linguistic Programming)
What Every BODY is Saying: An Ex-FBI Agent's Guide to Speed-Reading People
The Red Queen: Sex and the Evolution of Human Nature
Outliers: The Story of Success
Iron John: A Book About Men
Similar field report :
In high school, I had a major (lasting for years) oneitis for a girl in my class.
We dated for about 1 month when we were 15 - and then she broke it up. Which broke my heart pretty bad at the time. We didn't have sex but fooled around (full naked).
Fast forward about 18 years. I'm married, with a kid. She got married and got divorced after a while. We've been friends on Facebook, but no real conversations apart from saying happy birthday on her wall etc.
Anyways - I play in a band as a 2nd job and we had a gig in the town where she lives. I invite her (and a +1 if she wants to). She comes and stays till the end, and we chat for about 20 minutes before our tour bus heads back on the road.
Since then (about a year ago) she initiates chats over FB at least once a week. She even has dropped numerous hints about hooking up etc. We had a talk about how we used to fool around etc.
At one time we had a gig in Germany and she told me to take her with me, and when I said something to the effect of "weekend getaway with a married man? Scandalous" she merely laughed and made smiley faces etc.
She's still single with no LTR at the moment.
My take on this :
Even as a kid, the needy type (who loves them to the skies and will do anything to gain their favour) will get the kick on the butt.
Being married does not really stop women from making advances - it probably even creates a "chase" and "competition" feeling so they can say "he's married, but he still could not say no to me" in the end.
I probably won't go for a "close". I'm reading Iron John at the moment and I'd hate to be "the father who fooled around and left his family" and screw up the chance of my son becoming a proper man.
The controversial Iron John. Might be a little over the top for your needs, but it's very good.
you sound young a naive, not receiving or perhaps accepting the respect and acknowledgment of your families love - not realizing it yet, that love of the self and life. Really loving life. Maybe because you have not come close to death, I mean really close to cold, dark, death. More so, you sound like all fresh and stupid young boys do right when they leave high school; assured of their understanding of the world, an understanding that drastically changes every three to five years. Until one day, thirty years from now you look back and say, "I knew nothing when I was young". It's then that you realize this was all a feeling. One long feeling you had, that lasted days and years, as time seemed to slip by so painfully slow. Where a gut feeling of needed mobility took over and forced your fate into a position that only forgiveness and toughing it out can save for. A feeling of longing; Longing for adventure and a chance to prove oneself - a man's journey or hero quest. This feeling in men (and women) has been known since ancient times, only they had positive ways of promoting such innate human drives. Today, we have fraternities and the military, the factory or gangs. All shadow concepts of masculinity, all captivities shaded in brotherhood and silly concepts of sacrifice.
This is what the US military hopes for, besides all the other young and stupid children who knocked up a girlfriend and need money, or inner city kids who need a direction outside of gang life. The world you live in has been designed this way. To take the poor and wanting, and to place them in the machine. You're not going to fight for freedom, that fight belongs at a poll, and in protest, in letters to senators and special interest groups. The only freedom you'll find toting a gun in some foreign land is the same freedom men from constitutional nations always find, a small stipend to spend while corporations colonize foreign markets and people who would never sit by you at a table bank on your ignorance and hard work. You will be yelled at and broken, all for bits of ribbon or a tab. Told you're finally a man now, that you have found discipline, that you gained 'leadership skills'. All the while these traits were inside you, never on the outside, waiting to be emboldened and brought out of you; waiting for a moment of maturity and expression.
The only thing you seek in the military is a chance at expression, for something that is already there, just waiting for an outlet. If you don't want to die, don't be a soldier. If you're patriotic, then your nearest fight for liberty is at home against corruption and greed. If you want to be a man, become one of peace - because I assure you wholeheartedly, there are plenty of ex soldiers who are now men in pieces. Broken, berated and disturbed by the horrors that is war and a tighter bottom line.
Coast guard, if you must. But remember, all your life you will be searching for some semblance of inner peace, and that will never be found holding a weapon.
Works to consider: http://www.amazon.com/King-Warrior-Magician-Lover-Rediscovering/dp/0062506064
Thanks, good additions as well.
Iron John - https://www.amazon.com/Iron-John-Book-About-Men/dp/0306813769
> Perhaps a love and affection they have never experienced, but can only imagine? As one would imagine heaven. Or some other end state, when there are no end states.
Yes absolutely. For me, as an INFP personality type, I have an inner knowing of an idealized form of love. It's like a union of the divine masculine/feminine. In orgasm, it's like touching the void - getting a glimpse of heaven. I'm also attracted to BDSM where they are consciously exploring altered states of consciousness through sex. So perhaps NiceGuys are just more sensitive/intuitive type of men who through nature/nurture have a proclivity to want a more transcendent experience of love.
> They do seem to have an intense need to be seen as better than other men. But at the same time they are men, so they are not better than other men, in a generic sense. We are all men. We all share male desires. Lacking or pretending to lack male desire, does not make you better than other men. It makes you a eunuch.
Yes. It stems from a belief that they are flawed and not good enough as they are (like most humans). Once he begins to accept his own darkness, normalcy, and most hated parts of himself, he will begin to ground himself in reality. It won't actually remove his idealistic nature of love, it will actually just make him a lot less anxious and needy. He won't need a woman to validate his existence, but he can still enjoy their company.
> Fall from grace? The grace of denial?
Yeah that's one way of describing it. To accept their inner evil so to speak. I'm still healing from this fall which started happening years ago. So I can't say what it looks like on the other side. But I just know it will be ok.
No book will prepare you for law enforcement, it has to be touched, smelled, heard, and seen. If you're already a cop then the best thing you can do to be better is to be a well rounded human being and books can help with that.
Here's the recommended reading from some of the prior threads I was able to find in the sub.
Niceness can often be an insecure thirst for approval from women that masquerades as politeness and thoughtfulness. It lacks courage, and sometimes even lacks a willingness to tell the truth brazenly with compassion or to ACT with integrity instead of eternally seeking permission.
I earnestly suggest reading the book Iron John for a wholesome, holistic, multi-culturally rooted sense of what real manliness means. (The book was truly helpful for me, at least.)
What you're talking about is more or less in line with a psychoanalytic / Jungian interpretation. There's a lot of history and some disagreement^1, but generally the idea is that religion was instituted to codify morality into an easy-to-digest way (ie, making up stories that teach us how to behave morally) and to give a general model of human behavior and interaction, a sort of primitive social science.
I'm coming mostly from Carl Jung (Text 1 / Text 2 / Wiki), Jacques Lacan (Text / Wiki), Joseph Campbell (Text / Wiki), and Erich Fromm (Text / Wiki), but these anthologies give a decent scope of study: Ways of Being Religious and Religion, Society and Psychoanalysis.
There's also an entire sub-genre of what amount to self-help books based on mythology, interpreting myths to teach you how to be a better person: Myths to Live By, Iron John.
^1 One of the big disagreements between Freud and Jung was the role of religion in the mind of a subject. Freud believed it was a fantasy we use to bolster our own sense of importance and impart some sense of order onto the world that isn't there. Jung believed, while that may be true of fundamentalists or the neurotic/pathological, generally speaking it was a positive thing, that it created or strengthened social bonds, that it taught us things about ourselves and humanity.
It did seem like there weren't many solo ways to induce stress. I agree that meditation retreats (likely by Asians) are the best way to stimulate breakdowns in a controlled way. An issue may be that they'll focus more or compassion than strength for rebuilding the broken person.
A few years ago I read about several mens groups that attempt to offer a kind of modern manhood ritual for adults who feel they never had a transition to becoming men. As I recall many of these places were based on the book Iron John, which is based on the heroes journey concept. One place was called the Mankind project. As I recall the Mankind project was very coordinated to induce fear. The staff dress in black with black face paint and put you through a long talk to wear you down. During the talk if you need to use the restroom you have to use a trash can in the back of the room. At the end of the talk you're force to run out into the woods by yourself. At least this is what I've read on a few cult watch forums (it's considered a cult). Perhaps I will participate in it some time to research their techniques.
I think a primary issue is not that they don't exist but are often subject to socio-political debate and even ridicule due to male dominance in society. There was a well known (and highly satirized, certainly in the US) mythopoetic movement that was popular throughout the 1980s and 90s,
"The movement avoided political and social advocacy in favor of therapeutic workshops and wilderness retreats, often appropriating Native American rituals such as drumming, chanting, and sweat lodges, in which the mostly middle-class, middle-aged male participants sought to connect spiritually with a lost, 'deep' masculine essence." -wikipedia
The most noted elements being the poet Robert Bly and the influence of his [in]famous "Iron John: A Book About Men", and for its various New Agey spiritual retreats which were often simultaneouslyseriously written about and parodied in pop culture.
According to recent articles (2016, 2017), the movement is experiencing a resurgence, complete with detractors:
The Trouble with Gender in the Mythopoetic Men’s Movement.
Why The ‘New Masculine’ Movement Is Just As Toxic As The Old One by Erin Innes
Another fantastic read is Iron John by Robert Bly--who was heavily influenced by Marie-Louise von Franz
Read Mindfulness in Plain English, Healing Your Aloneness, and Iron John.
I'd recommend Iron John: A Book About Men
Oh! How good of you to remind me!
Book about the role of men in post-industrial society.
Also, I've heard it said that upon ceasing to be a bachelor, a man's money becomes "Our Money", while the woman's money remains her money.
short wiki article about it
no religious talk whatsoever. in my language it can be found as freebie not sure how it is with english edition
Okay, (obligatory "this isn't a replacement for medical help/attention so pay attention to your needs/get professional help when you see fit") so he said Iron John is a "masterpiece of writing", and also said that Fatherless America is well researched. No one thing will necessarily work for everyone, but they could be a good place to start. He said that both deal with the consequences of not having a father around, so it may not flat out address coping skills/mechanisms, but I think that just having certain aspects of fatherlessness brought to light (like the psychology as you mentioned) can hopefully give you some closure/solid mental framework for you to build on. He's got a couple of good "handouts" that he used to use in his private practice that I can have him email me if you'd like; I was the recipient of countless handouts growing up, all covering various topics, and while I hated them at the time, they're nice to have now to reflect on every now and then. Some of them priceless through the ups and downs. So let me know and I can figure out how to get them to you. Best wishes!