Reddit Reddit reviews The Great Theft: Wrestling Islam from the Extremists

We found 6 Reddit comments about The Great Theft: Wrestling Islam from the Extremists. Here are the top ones, ranked by their Reddit score.

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The Great Theft: Wrestling Islam from the Extremists
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6 Reddit comments about The Great Theft: Wrestling Islam from the Extremists:

u/austex_mike · 204 pointsr/worldnews

I may not agree with Iran on much, but on this issue they are correct. For the extremists to succeed they need three things in addition to their extremist ideology, they need 1) Money, 2) Weapons and 3) Recruits, and the West has given them all three in spades.

There is a book I am constantly encouraging people to read, it is from one of my former Islam professors, Khaled Abou Fadl. It is called The Great Theft: Wrestling Islam from the Extremists. It outlines basically how we ended up at this point. Here are a few thoughts, and some passages from the book:

The current problems we face can be traced back to 'Abd al-Wahhab, the 18th century religious leader in Saudi Arabia who is the namesake used by the conservative religious movement popular in Saudi, the Wahabbis. He was particularly intolerant of anyone he considered un-Islamic:

> ‘Abd al-Wahhab and his followers often engaged in rhetorical tirades against prominent medieval and contemporaneous jurists, whom they considered heretical, and even ordered the execution or assassination of a large number of jurists with whom they disagreed. In his writings, ‘Abd al-Wahhab frequently referred to jurists as “devils” or “the spawn of Satan” (shayatin or a‘wan al-shayatin), and therefore removed any psychological barrier to violating the memories or lives of distinguished scholars.

What is interesting, is that when we go back and look at the historical record, al-Wahhab's brand of religious brutality was shocking to the Muslim world at the time when he first started implementing it:

> One of the acts that ‘Abd al-Wahhab committed in Arabia, which generated a great amount of turmoil and opposition, was the stoning to death of a woman accused of adultery. Historical sources state that no one had been stoned to death in Arabia in a very long time, and that many jurists were horrified by what they considered to be the inhumane execution of this woman. This historical report is intriguing, because today stoning people to death is carried out all the time in Saudi Arabia without raising as much as an eyebrow.

Many of us take for granted the brutality meted out in the name of Islam by Saudis, but historical record shows that things were not always like this.

Britain decided to support the Saud family as the ruling family on the Arabian peninsula, and once control of Mecca and Medina fell into the hands of these fanatics (around 1925), it gave them a platform to spread their message throughout the Muslim world, since these places are where all Muslims, from all backgrounds, go on pilgrimage. With Britain signing the Treaty of Darin and the Treaty of Jeddah, Britain essentially gave the Hijaz area to the Saud family, and thus the Wahhabis, giving the puritans control of the most important area for all of Islam. We need to acknowledge this folly, and that a major European power was instrumental in giving the puritans such an important prize.

The main issue is that Wahhabism is extremely intolerant of any view outside of its own. It is particularly critical of any view of Islam that is not consistent with the "spiritual austerity" that it preaches:

> The main theme of ‘Abd al-Wahhab was that Muslims had gone wrong by straying from the straight path of Islam, and only by returning to the one true religion could they regain God’s pleasure and acceptance. With a puritanical zeal, ‘Abd al-Wahhab sought to rid Islam of all the corruptions that he believed had crept into the religion; for ‘Abd al-Wahhab these included mysticism, the doctrine of intercession, rationalism, and Shi’ism as well as many practices that he considered heretical innovations.

So in practice what this meant was that anything considered un-Islamic by the Wahhabi standard was considered heretical. The tragedy of this is that it encouraged people to ignore 1200 years of amazing Islamic law and scholarship. Prior to the Wahabbi takeover, there was a richness and diversity in Islamic law that was a strength, but now that diversity is often demonized as un-Islamic. But that diversity is important if we are going to take Islam back from the extremists:

> The Shari’a was richly diverse. Indeed, it is difficult to convey to modern readers the degree of richness and diversity that the Shari’a enjoyed. The only legal tradition that I am aware of that comes close to the richness of the Shari’a tradition is the Jewish Rabbinic tradition, with its multi-interpretive methods and various competing interpretations. As in the Rabbinic tradition, the students of Islamic law considered a wide range of alternative interpretations and opinions on any particular point of law, and the various sages of Islamic law worked hard to earn the respect and loyal following of a number of students, who in turn worked to spread and develop their master’s intellectual heritage. The Rabbinic tradition, with all its various sages, methodologies, and legal determinations, collectively represented Jewish law. Likewise, the Shari’a contained a wide range of ethical and moral principles, legal methodologies, and many conflicting and competing judgments. This rich and diverse matrix of opinions and judgments was collectively considered to be God’s law. In fact, to help visualize the phenomenon that I am describing, perhaps I should mention my own personal library on Islamic law. It contains about fifty thousand titles, the vast majority of which were written before the sixteenth century and as early as the ninth century. The books in this library represent a variety of approaches, schools of thought, and opinions written over the course of several centuries.

Two major events occurred in the 20th Century that caused the Wahhabi view to gain ascendancy in the Islamic world. The first was when the British decided to switch from coal to oil in their navy. The second was the 1973 oil embargo. Because the Saudis had some of the largest oil fields in the world, the money poured into the hands of the puritanical-supporting regime. Now, with this massive amount of money, the Wahabbis were able to export their brand of Islam easily. They funded only those places of learning that would support their narrow worldview, and deliberately censored anyone against it.

But the Brits weren't the only ones contributing to the problem. Many western governments were making things much worse in their own ways. In addition to the entire world basically pouring money into Saudi Arabia through their dependence on oil, many governments supported despotic regimes that often engaged in torture. This practice of torture creates the very people we are trying to rid the world of:

> it is important to take particular note of the consequences of torture, which is a regular staple of despotic governments. State prisons where torture is regularly practiced have given birth to some of the most puritanical and extremist orientations in the Islamic world. Importantly, the very practice of torture generates narratives of torture, tales of horror that are transmitted through society and that become part of the cultural fabric, and that play a significant role in deepening the sense of stress, fear, and lack of self-worth.

This is step one in giving the extremists recruits. A person tortured for their beliefs will be very open to anyone who gives them the opportunity to attack their oppressors, and at that point terrorist activities seem much more acceptable because they are against what they view as a great evil. It is probably not a coincidence that the most notorious and dangerous extremist in the world right now, Abu Bakr al Baghdadi, spent time in Abu Ghraib prison during a time when we know torture was occurring.

Now torturing people is not enough, extremists need more recruits than that. This is where civilian war casualties come into play. Recently we learned about an instance where an airstrike in Syria killed 100 civilians including many children. So now you have the family and friends of these innocent victims out there, trying to make sense of the slaughter. How many of those people will be sympathetic to the message of an extremist who whispers in their ear: "Are you upset with those people who killed your family? How about you join us in fighting them?" There will be people sympathetic to that message.

And finally weapons. It was announced that billions of weapons are being sold to Saudi Arabia. A country whose clergy praise the very conflicts that are destroying the Middle East.

So there you have it, this combination, this global endeavor, is making the problem of extremism worse. It's not just a Muslim problem, it's a world problem.

u/mybahaiusername · 8 pointsr/religion

There are people who prescribe the death penalty for apostasy in Islam, but I think a few things need to be taken into consideration here. I suggest anyone who is interested in learning about the issues of law and Islam pick up the book "The Great Theft, Wrestling Islam from the Hands of Extremists." It is written by a professor of law at UCLA, and it outlines how we arrived at the current situation today.

First and foremost, it is very important to take into consideration historical context. A long time ago the lines between apostasy and treason were blurry to say the least. It is important to note that often when a male was Muslim they were also expected to serve in the military on some level, and if they left the fold of Islam it was seen as joining the other side so to speak, and in some ways viewed as desertion.

This was especially true in the very early history of Islam when Jewish tribes we signing peace treaties then later breaking them with the Muslims. If someone were to leave and return to their Jewish tribe, it was seen as not just a matter of faith, but as a possibly treasonous/desertion act. There was great risk that these people could also go back to the other side and reveal military secrets, so it was seen as a possible act of espionage as well. It should also be noted the even the UK/US practiced the death penalty for things like treason and desertion, the [US executed a man in 1945 for desertion] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_by_the_United_States_federal_government#Military_executions) or the Rosenbergs being executed for espionage in 1953.

Now, it should also be noted that there was not always consensus about the appropriate punishment for apostasy. The Qur'an does not clearly state that death is the punishment for apostasy, in fact in pure faith terms the Qur'an often argues that we need to let people decide for themselves what their faith is, the Qur'an says, 'Unto you your religion, and unto me my religion,' [Qur'an, 109:6], and, "Whosoever will, let him believe, and whosoever will, let him disbelieve,' [Qur'an, 18:29], and, 'There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is distinct from error' [Qur'an, 2:256]."

The justification for death for apostasy is based on a series of hadith, and I would argue that if you look at the historical context of the hadith it was much more a case of a blurred line between apostasy/desertion than clear cases of people simply changing their belief. There was not widespread universal consensus that death penalty was the only punishment for treason, in fact the very well respected 14th century Islamic scholar Ibn Taymiyyah argued against the death penalty of apostasy. However, it was still a useful tool for state leaders to fight political opponents, so I think it is fair to say that the punishment of death remained alive and well under various rulers, and is still around today. But there are many Islamic leaders today who argue against the death penalty for apostasy in Islam.

Questions like these are always interesting. When the followers of a religion, or any particular belief system do something does it reflect on the religion as a whole? For example an number of US military had Bible quotes on their rifle scopes which begs the question: Who would Jesus snipe? Obviously we would say no one, but how many people have died at the hands of people who proclaim themselves Christians over the years? How many have died at the hands of people who claim to be atheists? Jews? Buddhists? Name your belief system and we can find examples of people killing for it, I think it reflects more on the individuals perpetuating the acts, rather than inherent issues with the belief systems themselves.

u/zjedi · 1 pointr/explainlikeimfive

For an excellent primer on the origin of Muslim extremism as a political tool, check out the book The Great Theft by Khaled Abou El Fadl.

"Here, he successfully argues that the extremist sects of Islam, mainly Wahhabism, blatantly defy the true values of Islam. He clarifies that Wahhabism was once an unpopular, fringe, cultlike movement, which only grew through a chance partnership with the Saudi Arabian ruling family. The discovery of oil created an unprecedented infusion of petro-dollars into the fledgling, conservative belief system. The point of the book, El Fadl writes, is to define "the reality of Muslim thought as it currently exists." He focuses on the extremists' "puritan" view, exposing the hypocrisies and inconsistencies inherent in their "imagined Islam." He doesn't offer specific solutions, but he raises the issues carefully and well. Though the writing can be dry and portions read like a law school lecture, overall El Fadl's book is a fulfilling read for moderate Muslims concerned about conservative leadership and any non-Muslims who want to inform themselves about the extremists' misuse of Islam."