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I woke up to a FB message from someone telling me that this had been shared here, so I tracked it; I'm the OP for the FB post. I'm sorry I'm so long-winded, but I just kept typing; it was actually just supposed to be a reach-out to some friends who are getting into ItWorks! and Lipsense, to caution them not to get too deep. I don't do a lot of social media, so I'm not good at viral posting or anything like that, but I wanted to come and provide more information from my notes for those interested. I got to sit in front of two subject matter experts for three hours, and everything I wrote was a credit to their life's work to undo the damage of high-demand groups.


I'm a Navy vet and psychology doctoral candidate from WV, and I work in mental health. I attended a training earlier this month from two guys from Wellspring WV, which is a really great facility that focuses primarily on helping people recover from re-education, high-demand groups, and what we could traditionally call "cult" activity and "brainwashing" (These awesome gentlemen are named Jeff Bryson and Greg Sammons; they also reference Dr. Alexandra Stein, who was a reformed cult member and is now a prominent SME in the field). It was about three hours of talking about the general tactics that are applied by the leaders of these groups to expand control. The focal point of the training was actually Scientology, but I was immediately fascinated by the claims that coercive control extended to MLM groups. Specifically, they mentioned someone from ASU (for the life of me, I can't remember who, because things were moving fast, there were a lot of slides, and I forgot to write down his name) who actually teaches a seminar on how to apply these coercion tactics in a MLM; so, ASU's School of Business has a MLM-factory,maybe from this Michael Sheffield dude somewhere in its midst (but he covers his ass by stressing that people only use the information "ethically". Yeah. Right.) So for the past few weeks, I've been poring through whatever literature I can find. Here are some of the things that have been in my general reading list, not focused on MLM:

• Heresy of Mind Control by Steven Martin
  
  
• Thought Reform and Psychology of Totalism by Robert J. Lifton
  
  
• Influence by Robert Cialdini
  
  
• Brainwashing and the Cults by Paul A. Verdier
  
  
• Movies: Dig, Faults, The Wave, The Firm, Join Us, Paradise Rediscovered, Betting on Zero; shows like The Path and The Following (you have to dig below the story, but many of the early episodes of each are good illustrations of some techniques)
  
  
  I'll make a response thread here with my lengthier notes.

So the nice thing about stuff like this is it really confirms these people are awful. I mean, am I really expected to believe this person is nice outside of LLR?

LLR is the biggest mystery to me. I can see how people get started with Tupperware, or pampered chef or cheapish items they would use anyway and want to try to get a deal on. Minimal investment. LLR requires SO MUCH MONEY just to get started. It is just insane. I can possibly see my friends maybe buying a pizza cutter or a microwave rice cooker but no way in hell could I ever convince myself my friends would buy clothes from me. We just don't buy that many clothing items. You are literally opening a clothing store and have no control over what they send you. I honestly can't see how this ever became popular.

I mean look right now these ultra soft leggings on Amazon are like $14, free shipping, fun patterns and lots of reviews.

That would be the general assumption, to have a education.

I'm currently looking up some of the names in the reports. Some lead to dead ends, but others cough up some information.

Young DG is obvious D(onald) Gary Young.

Woolley CL is This Guy AKA Cole L Woolley. Claims to have a PHD.

He was the VP of Research and Development at Young Living for 6 years (see above) which explains why his name is all over the documents i've linked above along with Gary. Gary had his degree from a Diploma Mill and supposedly Cole got his from Brigham Young University in utah. Surprise, he wrote a book also

"McClendon B" is curious. Only thing I found was a Distributor that may match the name, but it's fuzzy at best. She has been with them for 8 years though, is a nurse? Maybe she has some "pedigree" they tapped for some reason. Image of her linkedin

More as I find them. Pretty difficult since they use Initials or a variant of their name. Some I got lucky with, others unknown or nothing at all.

It is curious to note that some of the names are Asian in nature and they have a presence in asian countries now. Talked to some of their team members in the higher ranks who could find some medical "professionals" to give the illusion of clout to their studies?

If "McClendon B" is the actual one above who did some of the reports, that would prove it's not below them to just source folks near off the street who match their illusion of being able to offer clout/good text/images to their reports

I’ve heard Babelash is good. I’m asking for it for my bday, so I haven’t tried it yet. Maybe someone here can chime in on it.
Babe Lash Eyelash Serum 4mL POWERFUL Brow & Lash Enhancing Formula for Beautiful, Strong Lashes https://www.amazon.com/dp/B01C2EFAU6/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_2vn0AbJTHET03

Why not? Also, is this MLM related?

Edit: 🙄

Here is the original version of the book, which is 400-some pages long and written by a “holistic veterinarian”, whatever that might be. Apparently it does list which specific oils are safe for which animals, and gives cautions about others, which I would certainly hope for in a 400-page manual.

It appears that she only mentions YL brand products, so the book does appear to be at least MLM-adjacent, if not exactly MLM. Some of the Amazon reviews complain about this.

I still expect that the overall effect of most of the book’s advice is “nothing”. Maybe it’ll make your horse smell nice. If that. Oils aren’t medicine.

This was an enlightening read, Eric Sheibeler gives you a look of a man who has already climbed the ranks for 2 decades before waking up.
In the beginning of the book I was wary that this guy was maybe overly paranoid, but by the end you can see why.
This man and his wife did literally everything "right". And I mean everything.
If you want a great insight into the mechanics and history of this company, I highly recommend

Also I can't recommend this book enough.

Freedom of Mind: Helping Loved Ones Leave Controlling People, Cults, and Beliefs

Steven Hassan is considered one of the foremost experts on this topic, and many, many people have benefited from this book and his other books, Releasing the Bonds (2000) and also his earlier book, Combatting Cult Mind Control (1989).

If reading isn't your thing, here is Joe Rogan with Steven.

I've been using these techniques to speak with those in MLMs but also those with opposing political beliefs to mine in regards to our current POTUS (sigh) and I found it extremely successful.

Has he already read the Diary of a Wimpy kid series? My son is a year older than yours. He loved Diary of a Wimpy Kid. Here are a few series books kids that like Magic Treehouse might also like:

Stink Series
Jack Stalwart
Artemis Fowl ( also a graphic novel series)
A to Z Mysteries
The Lemonade Wars
The Lemony Snickett Series of Unfortunate Events
Anything by Louis Sachar

This list could go on to eternity. Basically you can search google with any of his favorites and add the keywords “Read Alikes” and find lists.

Magic Treehouse Read Alikes by Richland Library

Right before I got out of Young Living I was tempted to start the Lucy Libido classes, which is some hun who wrote a book about essential oils for sex. Now let me preface by saying that I was making $7 a month on my “business” and was looking for other ways to “grow” because it was “my own fault” that I wasn’t “rich” from this scam.

Anyhoozle, I asked my OBGYN about it because the best way to lose your sex drive as a woman is to have your lady bits taken out thus putting said woman into surgical menopause... yuck. So I was super curious as to how to help my libido (whose name is NOT Lucy btw). Well my OBGYN (will never need the OB part again) immediately was like “DONT EVER PUT ESSENTIAL OILS DOWN THERE!” And I was all “I didnt I swear!” Like a kid who was thinking about doing something wrong but got caught in advance of doing it.

So since my OBGYN went to many years of medical school and is one of the smartest people on the planet I trust her opinion way more than some hunbot who got bored in her marriage and her business started to fail so she wrote a book about how oils “saved her marriage slash sex life.”

You want to know what saved my marriage slash sex life? Quitting Young Living. Thats right me and my DH have been better in the last couple of months of no YL/MLM BS than we have been in the last couple of years when I was peddling oils.

But that’s just my opinion.....

Edit: added some quotation marks around sarcastic things.

I absolutely love reading these types of crazy Christian things. I need to get a copy of this. I’m sure it’s entertaining.

Edit: $15 on amazon https://www.amazon.com/More-Than-Sales-Seeking-Business/dp/0615960766/ref=nodl_

I've got a 700-page textbook about essential oil safety and I recommend it to anyone who is thinking about working with them. It doesn't really get into pet safety because lots of essential oils simply haven't been tested on pets - not that they should be. I don't believe in subjecting animals to that. I just assume they're all toxic and keep my animals away from them.

Yep, so do the ones in Hawaii. We call em B52s.

Edit: There's even a children's book about em, haha.

https://www.amazon.com/How-B-52-Cockroach-Learned-Fly/dp/0964749106

According to this book, The Good Old Days, They were Terrible!, people have always been this way.

yes! I’m sorry. I’m a jerk.

i hope this works, i suck at reddit:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0170Y97QQ/ref=cm_sw_r_sms_c_api_vRhRAbMBZWEHF

it’s literally called coochy

It seems that your comment contains 1 or more links that are hard to tap for mobile users.
I will extend those so they're easier for our sausage fingers to click!


Here is link number 1 - Previous text "are"

Here is link number 2 - Previous text "so"



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^Please ^PM ^/u/eganwall ^with ^issues ^or ^feedback! ^| ^Delete

There are so many other options though. All of them less than a third of the price, probably about comparable fast-fashion quality, and easily accessible.

This works just as well!

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0170Y97QQ/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_-ANYAbSSDQPFX

If you want an example to pass on to her, here you go:

LeggingGirl

Amazon

Are they the same company that published these?

I’m relatively new to this sub so I don’t know if links are allowed but since a few asked I found them on a quick break at work.

www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07CCTTY3M
www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B07BP11FWD

If it's this product, I'd switch to plain ole castor oil. The product contains isopropyl cloprost­enate, which is a synthetic compound that mimics prostaglandins, similar to the prostaglandin analogues in Latisse and other Rx lash serums. It makes me really uncomfortable to see people using stuff like this while not under supervision of a doctor.

This is disgusting and I’m angry just reading it.

Also incredibly sorry for your loss. This book helped a dear friend of mine after she miscarried. She’s not big into reading but devoured it within days.

Crank is an old common term for people who invent fake physics or math. For example :
https://www.amazon.com/dp/0883855070/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_wjfOAbRGJHJWH

(fantastic book by the way) I think it probably spread from there.

Jon Taylor is a finance/business professor, and also a former NuSkin rep, so he has a unique perspective. His writing is very readable and hard-hitting. His book, MLM Unmasked, is a free download from his website: http://www.mlm-thetruth.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/MLMunmasked-5-1-2017-CURRENT-1.pdf

Robert Fitzpatrick is the author of False Profits. It was published more than 20 years ago now so it's a little dated, but still very good reading. https://www.amazon.com/False-Profits-Financial-Deliverance-Multi-Level/dp/0964879514

Also this page provides a good summary and several specific examples of MLM abuse and fraud: https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Multilevel_marketing

(I had already entered this comment on a "r/antimlm" YouTube video that referenced this item, but I also decided to make this my first entry in this reddit group {actually, my first one on reddit, period} as it mentions just how "safe" some of this homemade toothpaste's ingredients actually are...)

I would "love" to show that reporter and dentist the entries I came across for the three oils mentioned in her “safer than store-bought” toothpaste in the reference book Essential Oil Safety (2nd Ed).

While both the reporter and dentist complained about all the chemicals listed on the ingredient list of a toothpaste tube, it turns out that the “safer” oils the dentist prefers are actually complex mixtures of multiple chemicals. Also, while these oils tend to be safe in the minute quantities that are present in their source plants, the concentrated versions can be very different in nature.

For instance, of the three oils mentioned:

Peppermint oil

• consists of 16 major chemical components.
  
• has this warning in the Safety Advice section of its entry:"Peppermint oil should be avoided altogether in cases of cardiac fibrillation, AND by people with a G6PD deficiency. This is a FAIRLY COMMON inherited enzyme deficiency, particularly in people of Chinese, West African, Mediterranean or Middle Eastern origin …” (emphasis mine)
  
  Cardamon oil (part of the doTERRA blend mentioned as the first ingredient)
  
  
• consists of (depending on the source plant) 10 or 11 major chemical components, with one called 1,8-Cinole being as much as 61.3% a part of the oil.
  
• that one component can cause breathing and Central Nervous System problems in young children, so it is recommended that this oil NOT be used around them.
  
  Cinnamon oil (also part of the doTERRA blend)
  
  
• depending on if the oil is exacted from the plant's bark or leaf, can consist of either 15 (bark) or 9 (leaf) major chemical components.
  
• can interfere with other drugs a person may be taking, with those who are taking diabetes or anticoagulant drugs at greatest risk
  
• also, the oil can inhibit blood clotting, which can be a problem for those undergoing major surgery, have a peptic ulcer, or suffer a bleeding disorder like hemophilia
  
• plus, the use of this oil is NOT recommended for women who are either pregnant or breast feeding.
  
• and one more thing: if the Cinnamon Oil in question was extracted from the leaf, it can contain up to 1% of a chemical known as Safrole. Based on tests done on lab animals, this substance is considered to be carcinogenic.
  
  So in other words, while that TV news feature is stating that this homemade toothpaste is "safer" than what is found in stores, it actually contains at least three ingredients that can cause problems for part of their viewership cannot handle.
  
  Nice reporting there...