Reddit reviews KING KW65 1000/6000 (with nagura stone)

I use this whetstone

KING KW65 1000/6000 (with nagura stone) https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00M8P96QE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_IMAUDbD9AB35X


It was recommended by a YouTube guy I watched as a budget/entry one to start with

This is one of those hot button topics that almost everyone has a different opinion, and is very passionate about that opinion. I've spent a considerable portion of my woodworking time on mastering my own sharpening technique and setup. Hopefully this is helpful to you

>Is a 400/1000 combination waterstone a good choice?

No. Anything below 1000 grit in a waterstone is better served by a different media. Preferably diamonds, but sandpaper can work too, and is my preference (more below)

>Doesn't starting at 1000 grit make the process take a long time?

No. A 1000 grit waterstone is actually pretty coarse and nowhere near where you want to stop sharpening.

>Do I really need to go that high?

No. But you'll want to

Sharpening basically can be broken down into 2 steps:

Sharpening - Shaping metal into an edge (sub 1000 grit)

Honing - refining that edge so it's suitable for work

Many people, especially when beginning put too much effort and equipment into "sharpening". But this step is rarely done. You only need to "sharpen" something when you get a new tool or damage an edge (drop it on concrete, hit a nail, etc). For Routine maintenance you are not going to go down to the 200 grit stones. It's completely unnecessary.

Honing - this is where you will spend 90% of your time if you are a woodworker and not a tool restorer. When an edge gets dull, it doesn't need to be re-shaped. It just needs to be refined. How much refinement is up to you and your wallet. Starting at 1000 grit is a good place. It's fairly coarse (read: quick) but not coarse enough were you have to worry about reprofiling the edge.

As far as how high you should go, there is a lot of argument. Most people who regularly use hand tools recommend going to 8000 girt. This is the sweet spot between a ridiculously sharp edge that is a joy to use and the fleeting edge retention. I personally hone to around 30,000 grit but I use mostly Japanese steel which is much harder than the steel western chisels/plane irons are and can take and keep that kind of edge better. I only hone my Western style chisels and plane irons (except Veritas PM-V11) to 8000 girt

Many people are perfectly happy with a 4000 grit edge. I might be one of them if I've never used an 8000 grit stone.

My recommendations

For Sharpening (the coarse and rarely used stuff), go buy a roll of 80 grit sandpaper and spray glue it to some MDF. That's exactly what I do. It works WAAAAY faster than super expensive "extra extra coarse" stones. The only thing quicker is a bench grinder.

After that you can decide on media. Waterstones are more economical and provide a better edge than diamond stones, but they require water (messy) and flattening. You can flatten a waterstone with some 220 grit sandpaper spray glued to to glass or MDF so it's not that big of a deal.

If you want an inexpensive one and done stone, here you go. 40 bucks for a 1k/6k stone. This is all you need to keep your tools sharp after you get them sharp initially.

Diamond stones are a lot more expensive. This set for 80 bucks will get your tools in the neighborhood of sharp, but no where near that King 6000 grit. The advantage here is no mess, no fuss. At one point I sold all my waterstones and bought about 400.00 in diamond plates. Only to sell all of them and repurchase the same waterstones I had before.

Also a word or caution. Manufacturers are shady when it comes to "grit". Look at the micron size. Diamond stone manufacturers call 3 microns 8,000 grit. While an 8000 grit waterstone is about 1 micron (that's a considerable difference). A 3 micron waterstone would be labeled 4000 grit.

> Should I just buy some stones, watch videos on youtube and go to town on a cheap blade?

Yes.

> So can you guys recommend some good stones for beginners? How many, and what grits?

This one and this one are great starters and will give you a mirror edge at 6k grit.

A good idea would be to get a whetstone, a wet japanese one, like this one.

Then, learn how to sharpen knives with him, it's a skill he'll need lifelong if he's to be a chef.

I'm lucky to have a great local sharpener, Hida Tool (in Berkeley). I bet they'd sharpen that knife if you mailed it to them. I'm 100% confident in their sharpening service, and they're priced fairly.

It looks like that edge just got rolled over, and there's a chip or two, but they're very small.

Just to get started I'd probably pick up this King 1000/6000 with Nagura:

https://www.amazon.com/d/Knife-Sharpeners/Japanese-Combination-Sharpening-KW-65-Nagura/B00M8P96QE/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1543212703&sr=8-5&keywords=king+6000

Start with the 6000 and see if you need to take it down to 1000. Main thing is try not to remove too much material or change the angle of the bevel. I'd leave a very small chip because it'll get sharpened out eventually and won't really affect cutting ability.

Check these PDFs for some tips:

https://imgur.com/a/u5eDovi

Pick up a simple leather strop and some green honing compound. I didn't strop my knives until recently, and it makes all the difference. Definitely look into that sooner than later.

Good on you for asking for input before taking it in!

I've tried all kinds of stones and my personal preference is this waterstone

https://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Combination-Sharpening-KW-65-Nagura/dp/B00M8P96QE/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1504556467&sr=8-2&keywords=king+waterstone

Thanks for the insight. Also, some of the knives you suggested come with a "initial sharpening" option when you order. Do you think this initial sharpening will get the knife sharp enough? (for example: http://www.korin.com/Knives/Inox-Western-Style_2 )
When it comes to sharpening, I've been reading about stones and am considering this stone. Any thoughts? https://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Combination-Sharpening-KW-65-Nagura/dp/B00M8P96QE Yes, I know it's rather cheap but this is my first foray into Japanese knives and I'm looking for something that will get the job done.

7 inches is actually really small for a chefs knife FWIW. But if its what you think she would be comfortable with its an ok choice. Lots of lady chefs I've worked with seem to favor smaller blades.

Though I've also worked with girls half my size swingin around 12 inchers...

That said I can't think of many knives that fit your choice combo and budget off the top of my head. Western styled knives, barring customs or the high end stuff usually stick to the triple rivet handle instead of the rounder wa-style you see in japanese blades. I could just be tired and dead right now though so if someone wants to correct me and recommend something better by all means.

But I think perhaps this Shun and this stone would be the most fitting for what you're aiming for within budget. Its kindasorta westernized japanese and its got a combination of performance/frill she'll probably enjoy.

Thank you for your reply!

I currently have those 2 whetstones:

• 1000/6000 (https://www.amazon.ca/King-Japanese-Combination-Sharpening-KW-65/dp/B00M8P96QE/)
  
• 400/100 (https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0055B2RGO/)
  
  As a side note, I thought there would be more difference performance wise between the whustof and the henckles international, since they have such a significant price difference. I know they use the same steel but I thought perhaps a thinner blade?! Anyway, if the only performance improvement is the handle, that is definitely not worth the upgrade.

My first stone was a Kai 240/1000, which I got because it was cheap. It got me started on sharpening technique, and I restored a few mangled knife blades out of it. It does a great job, despite its smaller size

My current stone is a King 1000/6000, priced at only $40. I've spent a lot of time practicing proper technique with the King stone, and can get my Henckels Santoku sharp enough to shave (which I think is impressive for a $40 knife). My Shun Chef is sharp enough to do surgery. Shun uses VG-10, a much harder steel (HRC around 60) which requires a very consistent technique to polish properly.

If you want to move up in quality after that, you're looking at $100+ per stone.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.dmtsharp.com/sharpeners/bench-stones/duosharp/&ved=2ahUKEwiOze6PiKbjAhVjiOAKHeUCBs4QFjAAegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw3BgxHYOtbtlQQL7gd_onAc

https://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Combination-Sharpening-KW-65-Nagura/dp/B00M8P96QE/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?keywords=king+stone&qid=1562614609&s=gateway&sr=8-4

I use course/fine on the dmt and then 1000/ 6000 grit. Finish all my knives on a 10k stone. Sharpen my knives once a week to keep them razor sharp.

So, a cleaning stone for the whetstones should be like this then? Messermeister Sand Rubber Cleaner for Whetstone

and for sharpening i should probably use something like this? King Japanese Grit 1000/6000 Combination Sharpening Stone KW-65 and King #8000 Nagura Stone : Bundle - 2 Items

I think this is kind of the standard recommendation. If I went back I probably would have saved my money and got a Chosera 1k and Chosera 3k. But that’s significantly more

King Japanese Grit 1000/6000 Combination Sharpening Stone KW-65 and King #8000 Nagura Stone : Bundle - 2 Items https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00M8P96QE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_OvXGAb2M3MEQV

I use a King (brand) Japanese 1000/6000 sharpening stone. There are several grades made. They are a wet stone - you oil the blade afterwards. It does a good job, but takes patience.
https://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Combination-Sharpening-KW-65-Nagura/dp/B00M8P96QE About $40.

I also go to second hand equipment sales, etc. You can pick up some older tool sharpening stones - for about $10 - some new in the (1040s?) box.