Reddit reviews Mistakes Were Made (But Not by Me)

This is an excellent book which explores the lengths people will go to cling to a disproved idea that they're emotionally invested in:

Mistakes were made (but not by me)

There were lots of similar stories from the time when DNA testing was first invented and people started doing tests on convicted rapists who insisted they were innocent. It turns out that there lots of cases where the DNA in the sample of semen taken from the victim didn't match the DNA of the man who'd been convicted of the crime.

You'd think that would be conclusive, end of story, he didn't do it. But the news that they'd jailed the wrong man was confronting to police, prosecutors and judges. So in many cases they opposed attempts to overturn the man's conviction and they invented bizarre, implausible scenarios to "explain" why the convicted man was still guilty even though the DNA didn't match.

This situation is another example of the same thing.

There is a book called "Everybody makes mistakes... except me" "Mistakes were made (But not by me)". It outlines different cognitive biases and the rationalisation process of individuals to justify their mistakes instead of owning up to it. It was years ago when I first read it but iirc one topic it mentioned is doubling down on the belief when challenged and we all know too well about that in both personal and sociopolitical level.

The book is eye-opening and personally I think it made me wiser and more mindful of my thoughts and decision making than before and therefore I really think that people should read it even just a couple of chapters to improve their decision making based on sound judgement rather than by emotions. I know too many people who behave based on emotional and irrational instincts and it grates me when they impose their irrational, instinctual beliefs. All too often, many people lack the introspection and we would go a very long way if people would read the "Everybody makes mistakes..." "Mistakes were made" book.

Edit: So, initially mentioning the title of the book was mistaken, but not by me.

Edit: also grammar

Please remember to 上vote! Alligator dezaimas!

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Weekly Complaint Thread - 26 January 2017

> As per every Thursday morning- this week's complaint thread! Time to get anything off your chest that's been bugging you or pissed you off.
>
> Rules are simple - you can complain/moan/winge about anything you like, small or big, it can be a personal issue or a general thing, except politics. It's all about getting it off your chest. Remain civil and be nice to other commenters (even try to help).
>
> > /u/2catsinjapan:

>>Had to go to a different hospital for a bunch of tests (next Friday I'll find out if I'm gonna live or be forced to have vital bits chopped out so I can live) and the docs there decided that since I'm clearly a foreigner they were going to speak really loud and really slow.
>>
>>Told them that I'm foreign, not deaf.
>>
>>They seemed very surprised by it.
>>
>>And continued talking to me like I was a hearing impaired brain damaged person.
>>
>>Finally stopped when I started responding to them in the same manner.
>>
>>Now, keep your fingers crossed for me.
>>I don't want to end up being forced to do an Angelina Jolie.
> > > /u/luxeguard:

>>> Japan has an aging population and hospitals tend to have an even larger percentage of oldsters visiting them. Because of this hospital staff have gotten into the habit of speaking loudly. It is necessary. Check the nurse's station. You will usually find a megaphone sitting there because they use it often. I know this because I spent two weeks in the hospital last year and many of the nurses and doctors used really loud voices with me. When my (Japanese) wife visited me they used that same voice with her.
>>>
>>>You said you were foreign not deaf? Is that polite in your country?
>>>Why complain about others when you can't control yourself?
>>>
>>>It is best to be polite and patient even when others aren't.
>>>
>>>
>>>
> > > > /u/2catsinjapan:

>>>>Due to my condition I visit different medical establishments pretty often. You're not the only person familiar with hospitals here, but nice try.
>>>>
>>>>When the staff uses normal voices and normal Japanese to other people, including older Japanese patients, shock and horror (so much for your excuse) but switched to loud kindergarten Japanese when they saw a foreign person, yeah I was triggered. Because despite what you want to believe , that's not normal.
>>>>
>>>>And no, there wasn't anything rude in my response to them.
>>>> I simply pointed out an obvious fact.
> > > > > /u/luxeguard:

>>>>>Not trying to do anything but explain my experience.
>>>>>I don't want to believe anything in particular. In fact I believed as you did before I spoke to the staff about it and watched how others were spoken to. I was pretty pissed because it fit nicely with my preconceived notion about Japan and the Japanese. It felt really good to find yet another example of how culturally ignorant, childish and downright rude Japanese people can be. Damn these people!
>>>>>
>>>>>Except it didn't fit and I was man enough to admit it. Everyone yells in hospitals here my friend.
>>>>>
>>>>>You don't need to fire back with a personal attack. Check [this book] (https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132) out, it helped me (is helping me) a lot.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
> > > > > > /u/gude_gudetama:

>>>>>>> Not trying to do anything but explain my experience.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Then why hijack her post in a complaint thread to "prove her wrong"? You could make your own post in the praise thread??
> > > > > > > /u/luxeguard:

>>>>>>>Not praising anyone or anything. Why would I do that?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>I can't comment on or disagree with a sweeping generalization?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Some complaints are undeserved - just my experience. If someone wants to believe that Japanese doctors see non-Japanese speaking people as children that must be yelled at so be it. Enjoy yourself.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>My experience is that the ONLY time I have had people consistently use a loud voice with me over the last 22 years in Japan was in hospitals and clinics. I investigated and found out the reason.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>If you are yelled at when going into a clothing store, convenience store, town hall, train station, Hello Work or community center I would be very surprised. Must be a reason for the difference huh? The reason is that old people have bad hearing and they are in the overwhelming majority in hospitals.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>If you are not invested in your complaints and gripes maybe, just maybe you'll find out you were wrong. It happens.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Notice I didn't "downvote" your comment? :)
> > > > > > > > /u/gude_gudetama:

>>>>>>>>> Not praising anyone or anything. Why would I do that?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>I mean praise of your own attitude readjustment because you were 'man enough' thing? Or reducing 'investment' in complaints and gripes, which I have no idea what that is even supposed to mean. Good for you?
> > > > > > > > > /u/luxeguard:

>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Some people think that every unpleasant experience they have in Japan is proof that Japan is out to get them (confirmation bias). Anyone that works in a hospital anywhere in the world is laughing at the OP's experience.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>The reason the doctor slipped into using a loud voice again is the same reason that people that return home from a noisy factory job talk loudly in their livingrooms - it has become a habit! Japanese people are not out to get you. LOL.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Done here, bye bye.
>>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > > > > > /u/gude_gudetama:

>>>>>>>>>>> Anyone that works in a hospital anywhere in the world is laughing at the OP's experience.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Interesting that you should mention that, as I have worked in hospitals, and I know a few Japanese nurses, doctors and pharmacists that work in hospitals here.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>I wasn't actually talking about any of that, though, but I guess you're missing my point.
> > > > > > > > > > > /u/luxeguard:

>>>>>>>>>>>1. God only knows what your point is.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>2. Pharmacists don't work in hospitals in Japan.


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^(Check out copy-kun on) ^github!

Yes, excellent answer. I'm currently reading "Mistakes Were Made, But Not By Me"

https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132

& The author, Carol Tavris, discusses the way people justify their actions after they've made a poor decision - which reinforces future bad decisions in the same direction or rut.

> And It's not what most every other person on the planet would have done, because most people don't go flopping their cocks out to random women.

Nowhere did I say everyone else in the world flops their cocks out, simply that most people avoid telling the full truth or admitting to something if they don't have to.

It's why we have civil courts and criminal courts. Whether it's murdering your wife or being the person who accidentally broke a lamp, people don't just admit to things freely when there are other options. Even in courts when people admit guilt it's often for a lesser sentence because they know that if they don't admit it then, that the truth would eventually come out.

And as in my other comment, children who have very little experience in the world default to "it wasn't me" when confronted with something. Even when it's pretty clear they did it. You can tell your child time and time again that telling the truth is better and they won't be punished for telling the truth, but they will still try their damnedest to prove they didn't do what you accused them of. There's this book that covers how the brain is wired in a way that you don't want to admit to mistakes you've made. It's in our nature to avoid admitting to things we've done, particularly when you know the thing you did was wrong, foolish, disgusting, etc.

There is an aptly titled book describing this phenonema.

The book "Mistakes Were Made But Not By Me"
is very useful in explaining what's going on in the the minds of people who by all measure should realize they are wrong but don't.

(Hint: its not just LDS people who have this problem. We can all fall victim to irrationality)

https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132

> This is fascinating to me because in our modern culture accepting responsibility for things that go wrong that a person or institution played a role in is widely accepted as a moral necessity (or at least a moral good).

FYI, this is a book on that subject. It's not really as universally accepted as you might think:

Mistakes Were Made (But Not By Me)

>Why do people dodge responsibility when things fall apart? Why the parade of public figures unable to own up when they screw up? Why the endless marital quarrels over who is right? Why can we see hypocrisy in others but not in ourselves? Are we all liars? Or do we really believe the stories we tell?

>Renowned social psychologists Carol Tavris and Elliot Aronson take a compelling look into how the brain is wired for self-justification. When we make mistakes, we must calm the cognitive dissonance that jars our feelings of self-worth. And so we create fictions that absolve us of responsibility, restoring our belief that we are smart, moral, and right—a belief that often keeps us on a course that is dumb, immoral, and wrong.

>Backed by years of research and delivered in lively, energetic prose, Mistakes Were Made (But Not by Me) offers a fascinating explanation of self-deception—how it works, the harm it can cause, and how we can overcome it.

It sounds like it was simply too painful for your mother to admit that it was a farce. The scale of the immorality of the mission was just too much to take. It makes me think of Mistakes Were Made (But Not By Me).

I've only listened to part of this as an audiobook and it honestly horrified me.

There was an entire chapter or two about this in the book "Mistakes Were Made But Not By Me." https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132

It went over how bad most of the interrogation training is. Many of them are basically trained to "trick" people into confessing even if they aren't guilty. Then once they get that cognitive dissonance kicks in and the refuse to re-look at evidence or admit fault later if proven wrong. It was really eye opening to me and did not enhance my trust in the police. >.<

One thing with conformation bias is learning to tune into the feelings that dissonant information causes. I was not personally freaked out about confirmation bias as to the Bible, God or the Org because I wanted so badly for it to be true for so long that realizing I had been wrong was a relief. I could finally let the reason stop being shut down by the feelings.

What I have noticed is a new feeling. One of wanting to see people wake and the org get exposed. And this is creating a new confirmation bias in me. It makes me want to question motives and see the worst in every little thing they do. I am trying to resist it, last thing I want to do is become too eager in my desire to confirm how bad the org is. Not every new little thing they do is a trick, a manipulation or a money grab. Some of it is, but it is so easy to take every news item about them and weave a narrative based more on my distaste and hurt feelings than the actual evidence.

Edit: Hey if you would like a whole book devoted to cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias check out: Mistakes Were Made But Not by Me: Why We Justify Foolish Beliefs, Bad Decisions and Hurtful Acts my journey didn't start with apostate sites, it started with that book entirely by accident.

https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132

Mistakes Were Made - Carol Tavris & Elliot Aronson - A great insight into how we justify our behavior, you can learn a lot about yourself from it.
https://www.amazon.com/Mistakes-Were-Made-But-Not/dp/1491514132