Best prehistory books according to redditors
We found 78 Reddit comments discussing the best prehistory books. We ranked the 39 resulting products by number of redditors who mentioned them. Here are the top 20.
We found 78 Reddit comments discussing the best prehistory books. We ranked the 39 resulting products by number of redditors who mentioned them. Here are the top 20.
TL;DR The site's real, the clip is misleading.
The structures at Gobekli Tempe are real, and their origins are indeed something of a mystery. There is real, honest-to-goodness archaeology going on at the site. This video clip however, shows quite clearly why a great deal of the programming on the History Channel needs to be taken with a grain of salt. Here are a few issues I have with the clip that's been presented.
Hancock is famous for writing such 'alt-history' books as 'Fingerprints of the Gods' and 'Underworld: The Mysterious Origins of Civilization', which assert that all human civilizations are the product of an ancient, hyper-advanced civilization (like Atlantis, for example), that either inspired or outright taught the younger civilizations that followed. His views are, to put it mildly, not supported by either the archaeological community, nor by the archaeological evidence.
Expert number three is Robert M. Schoch, a geologist and geophysicist who's current pet theory is that all ancient pyramids (Egyptian, Mayan, etc.) are the products of an ancient, global civilization that was destroyed by some pre-historical cataclysm in ages past, possibly by a century-long rain of asteroids.
Next on our list of History Channel approved 'experts', is one Andrew Collins, author of 'Gateway to Atlantis', a book which alleges that ancient Middle-Eastern civilizations may have had transoceanic contact with ancient meso-Americans, possibly via contact with Atlantis or some other ancient global civilization.
Oh Gawd... at 6:00 in the clip, the 'documentary' begins to speculate if this find has anything to do with Noah's Ark.
Next up, Phillip Coppens: ancient aliens, 2012, ancient global civilizations and catastrophes. Seeing the pattern here?
Most, if not all of these 'experts' are cult archaeologists who have, at one time or another, flirted with or explicitly endorsed the concept of 'hyperdiffusion', which is the belief that all ancient cultures sprang from an older, advanced, global culture such as Atlantis, Lemuria, or Mu. This is one species of pseudohistory that has been quite popular over the years. The ideas that are stated (or sometimes simply implied) in this clip are a fairly obvious attempt to graft the assertions of the pseudoarchaeologists onto an actual archaeological site. The video even concludes by splashing a 'See the Evidence: Check out Ancient Aliens on History Channel' graphic. Others in this thread have warned against dismissing a claim because one doesn't approve of the source, and that is generally a good rule to follow, but in this case, a fair degree of skepticism is warranted. A good analogy here would be that these 'experts' are to the field of archaeology what homeopaths are to the field of medicine. This clip isn't history; it's pseudohistorical speculation attempting to masquerade as legitimate archaeological inquiry.
> I think Neanderthals were as intelligent as Homo sapiens.
That's a fairly minority position ...
> My speculation is that they never got 10000 years of climate stability like humans enjoyed during the Holocene.
Except they did. Neanderthals existed between 350kya and 42kya. Now look at the global temperatures for that period. So there was a warm period between 110,000 and 125,000 years ago that would be about as warm as it is now (omitting very recent climate change effects for the moment).
> OTOH, humans were lucky enough to live during a time were the global temperature remained +- 1 C for ten thousands years.
Ok, first of all, the term "humans" applies both to Neanderthals and Homo sapiens. Second of all, the prehistoric agricultural theories have settled on the idea that basic domestication of cereal crops occurred in at most a few centuries; i.e., the only thing preventing homo sapiens from developing agriculture was a relatively brief period of time when climate allowed for it.
(Just look at the Kebaran -> Natufian development relative to the Bølling-Allerød interstadial and the Younger Dryas. The Ice Age stopped briefly, they tried to adopt sedentism and were on their way leaving archeological evidence, then the ice age came back, and it pwned them. And when the ice age ended for real, modern societies basically formed. This is all described in Steven Mithen's After the Ice in the "Western Asia" chapter at the beginning).
Third of all, 15,000 years seems like plenty of time (the 110,000 to 125,000 time period I was referring to) to develop agriculture even if, for some reason, you are running somewhat slower than the Natufians.
> Technologies like agriculture and writing had time to grow and develop in a relatively stable climate.
Writing follows from advanced cultures growing out of agricultural societies. That is to say, agriculture by itself is the essential bottleneck of concern, writing is almost inevitable once an agricultural society gets large and sophisticated enough.
> After 9,500 years of a stable climate and accumulation of information, the renaissance happened, from there industrialization and the Information Age happened.
Well ... as Jared Diamond correctly points out (in "Guns, Germs, and Steel" and other publications of his), it is actually geography that creates the climate stability. Basically, the Middle-East, Indus Valley, and some parts of China are basically in climate zones where one can develop long-term agriculture sedentary societies.
You only need some kind of reasonable interstadial period between ice ages, which the Neanderthals definitely experienced (and yet failed to develop agricultural societies).
Another fantastic reference for the pre-historic peopling of the Americas is After the Ice (Harvard University Press, 2006) by Steven Mithen.
While the book focuses on the worldwide rise of human cultures after the end of the ice age, the chapters on the Americas do go into some depth on the different archeological groupings of pre-Columbian era Native Americans and examine several of the sites that have challenged the Bering Land Bridge theory due to their age and lack of relation to later cultures.
You wanted to be part of the intelligentsia, but throughout your philosophical journey, you always based your convictions only on authority and tradition instead of on evidence and arguments. Don't you realize that this is the epitome of anti – intellectualism?
It is correct that the New Atheists aren't the pinnacle of atheistic thought and didn't contribute many new ideas to the academic debate of atheism vs. theism or religion. But this was never their goal, and it is also unnecessary, since the academic debate is already over for many decades. If you want to know why the arguments for theism are all complete nonsense and not taken seriously anymore, why Christianity is wrong just about everything and why apologists like Craig are dishonest charlatans who make a living out of fooling people, your reading list shouldn't be New Atheists, but rather something like this:
Colin Howson – Objecting to God
George H. Smith – Atheism: The Case Against God
Graham Oppy – Arguing about Gods
Graham Oppy – The Best Argument Against God
Herman Philipse – God in the Age of Science
J. L. Mackie – The Miracle of Theism
J. L. Schellenberg – The Wisdom to Doubt
Jordan Sobel – Logic and Theism
Nicholas Everitt – The Non-Existence of God
Richard Gale – On the Nature and Existence of God
Robin Le Poidevin – Arguing for Atheism
Stewart Elliott Guthrie – Faces in the Clouds: A New Theory of Religion
Theodore Drange – Nonbelief & Evil
[Avigor Shinan – From Gods to God: How the Bible Debunked, Suppressed, or Changed Ancient Myths and Legends] (http://www.amazon.com/dp/0827609086)
Bart Ehrman – The New Testament: A Historical Introduction to the Early Christian Writings
Bart Ehrman – Jesus, Interrupted
Bart Ehrman – Misquoting Jesus
Burton L. Mack – Who Wrote the New Testament?
Helmut Koester – Ancient Christian Gospels
John Barton, John Muddiman – The Oxford Bible Commentary
John Dominic Crossan – Jesus: A Revolutionary Biography
Karen Armstrong – A History of God
Mark Smith – The Early History of God
Randel McCraw Helms – Who Wrote the Gospels?
Richard Elliott Friedman – Who Wrote the Bible?
Robert Bellah – Religion in Human Evolution: From the Paleolithic to the Axial Age
Robert Walter Funk – The Gospel of Jesus
One important thing to consider is that science tends to be extremely conservative. Making claims without evidence is heavily downvoted. Due to the nature of preservation of different materials, we can only examine a tiny slice ancient material culture.
Stones and bones are preferentially preserved over more ephemeral artifacts - fibrous material, wood, furs & feathers. But since we rarely see evidence of wooden or woven material from 15kya archaeologists can't say much about it - the silence inadvertently causes us to assume that 'cavemen*' only had stone tools and bone fishhooks. This is preposterous, of course.
There is evidence of woven fabrics from the impressions made on the surface of ceramics. That helps to push back the earliest evidence for textiles several thousands of years beyond any actual textiles themselves. Also, dating the differentiation between louse species has suggested strong evidence that humans were clothing themselves at least 70,000 ya. This sort of thing can place a bound on a certain technology.
But I can't stress enough that just because we don't have physical evidence that people knew how to, say, weave a basket, doesn't mean that they didn't do it. People may have been weaving baskets 100,000ya for all we know - but there's ZERO evidence for that, and so archaeologists and anthropologists won't be able to say that.
So to get back to your comment - It is almost a certainty that people living 100,000 - 15,000 ya were not anywhere close to as cavemannish as is popularly described. When using comparative methods, the view changes drastically. Tribes of people deeply familiar with all the plant and animal resources in their range; some moving great distances with the seasons, others moving less; technological sophistication relying on plant & animal materials; language? Oral tradition? Symbolic life?
As for sources, I mentioned a book in a different comment, but it's worth repeating:
After The Ice by Stephen Mithin. Good on the science, light speculation, no aliens (except his time-travelling narrator, of course)
After the Ice is a great resource. Interesting narrative style as well.
The Horse, the Wheel, and Language is also a great (although fairly technical) book about the origin and spread of the Indo-European language which had a large effect on the bronze age cultures in the area.
Here's my personal favorite
"Wilson shows that not only did Atlantis exist but that the civilizing force behind it was the Neanderthals...the Neanderthals had sophisticated mathematical and astrological knowledge, including an understanding of the precession of the equinoxes, and that they possessed advanced telepathic abilities...These abilities, he demonstrates, have been transmitted through the ages by the various keepers of the hermetic tradition--including the Templars, Freemasons, and other secret societies. In the course of his investigation, Wilson also finds new information about historical links between the Masonic tradition and the Essenes that indicate that America was “discovered” long before Columbus set sail and that Jesus actually survived crucifixion and fled to France with his wife Mary Magdalene."
It's really got something for everyone.
This is well towards the end of and past the period you're asking about, but I really enjoyed After the Ice: A Global Human History 20,000 - 5,000BC. It's got this interesting narrative conceit where the author conjures the spirit of a 19th century paleoanthropologist and sends him around the world to various human habitations, so the viewer sees them through his eyes and what would otherwise be a dry survey of archeological digs becomes more like a story being told by a knowledgable person. The goal is to describe how the world changed during the last great phase of human pre-history and created the conditions necessary to propel humans into civilization. One part that sticks in my head is from very early on and its how he moves from a group that live in seemingly idyllic conditions in the levant (IIRC) to another group suffering through a harsh Ice Age winter, huddled together and all with their backs to a fierce wind. The difference in mobility and group-size really stuck with me.
Those guys are horrible at history. I would recommend going to /r/badhistory for rebuttals, in the meantime I found some books that I think can really help out debunking this myth.
Science and Religion: A Historical Introduction
Philosophy of Science: An Historical Anthology
Galileo Goes to Jail and Other Myths about Science and Religion
When Science and Christianity Meet
The Genesis of Science: How the Christian Middle Ages Launched the Scientific Revolution
The Beginnings of Western Science: The European Scientific Tradition in Philosophical, Religious, and Institutional Context, Prehistory to A.D. 1450
The Savior of Science
For the Glory of God
The Bible, Protestantism, and the Rise of Natural Science
The History of Science from Augustine to Galileo
Yes this is a long list but that's because it's studied so often ;). I hope this helps.
Bit of a warning, I might have gotten a bit too much. But, in my search I realized we have a rather large section of rock art. So let me know if you'd like any feedback on rock art traditions and archaeological assessments, or if that's much too obscure and prehistory for you.
Starting with the prehistoric suggestions and moving on from there, Movement, exchange and Identity in Europe in the 2nd and 1st millennia BC takes a look at Ireland and Britain social exchanges with the rest of Europe, with an argument that the channel didn't inhibit progress and the exchange of ideas/trade but actually was conducive to such things. It's a collection of papers.
More of an extension off the first suggestion, Becoming European looks at the earliest foundations for European culture and traces the influence of those prehistoric civilizations into modern day. More of the same with Bronze Age Connections so really you have your choice of the group for which might better suit what you're looking for.
The next title, Romans and Barbarians Beyond the Frontiers brings together academics on Roman Britain, specifically looking at the surviving viewpoints of Rome's take on "barbarians" of the north. There's quite a bit of research, both broad and niche, about Roman Britain but that doesn't tend to focus specifically on northern Europe like this collection does.
Slight aside, one of the interesting socio-political heroes that come from this time period is Arminius, and while lately he's been associated in a negative light, the original story of him being captured, raised in Rome, and eventually betraying Rome during a military campaign in the north, is pretty interesting. Forbes had an article about the coin deposit discovery that confirmed the location of the battle, just to get you started in that direction if you're interested. Maybe a bit too obscure?
Apparently this book isn't in production anymore, but it's in my database so maybe you might luck out and find a library that has it. But splendour of power examines the material and social value of kings and gold/silver, specifically around the North Sea - so smack dab in the region you're look at. Bit unfortunate it's not in print. A quick google search yielded this, so maybe delve more into that if you're interested?
Moving on down the timeline, Everyday Products in the Middle Ages looks at the average consumer and individual's lifestyle in relation to archaeological objects.
Next to each other, both focus on a specific region but examine social spheres, are Myth and Materiality in a Woman's World for Shetland and Myth and Materiality for Ireland. Both look at how myths and research can feed into the other, while providing specific case examples throughout history of both locations.
For a more contemporary take, the essay Heritage and Peacebuilding by Diana Walters does include regions outside of your list, but the first half takes a look at northern Europe and the Balkans in order to see if a peaceful society is attainable looking at the heritage/history of each region.
And since war is an extension of politics by another means, there are quite a lot of books on warfare in the region! I nabbed the Roman Britain one because it's perhaps the most extensive list, with Warfare in Northern Europe Before the Romans - which is, as the title says, actually prior to Rome's influence.
If you'd like a main source, the publisher Pen & Sword seems to have quite a selection of war, war histories, family histories and the like. Their Your Towns and Cities in the Great War series provides exhaustive coverage of UK cities that were impacted by the Great War. Really useful and helpful if you want primary sources such as legal documents, letters, death certificates and copies of land deeds.
Sorry if that was a bit much! I had trouble narrowing things down and left a lot off at the last minute because I was concerned about being on point. These are all pretty scholarly, but that's research texts for you. The Pen & Sword books should be more trade-focused as far as price points are concerned. And as always, double check local universities and libraries near you since we can usually afford the big research collections!
Steady reading!
They weren't matriarchal. Women did not rule. They may have been matrifocal, but I don't even know if that's clearly known. The role and power of women in Babylon was played up by some 1970's feminist academics, but that view has come under criticism:
Here's an example: The Myth of Matriarchal Prehistory by Cynthia Eller.
Perhaps this isn't a big issue, but it makes me doubt your 'neutrality':
>many ancient peoples had heavily matriarchal societies
I strongly doubt you'd be able to support that claim. There have certainly been egalitarian cultures prior to the advent of agriculture. But the existence of matriarchies simply isn't supported by the facts. It's basically a feminist mythology. See Cynthia Eller's The Myth of Matriarchal Prehistory.
I've been reading After the Ice as of late, can recommend
Here is a short list of books I have used in my studies of Anthropology. I don't have anything on cultural anthropology because it's not my focus (I focus on physical anthropology and archaeology).
Physical Anthropology:
Linguistic Anthropology:
Archaeology (specifically of the American Southwest, where I study):
Hope this helps!
Also, if you need any information on Forensic Anthropology, I have about 45 textbooks I've dug up to prepare for graduate school, with about 6 introductory textbooks (you may want to read those physical anthropology texts beforehand).
Best of luck to you!
Note: Sorry about the formatting, I can't ever get bullets to work right
Actually it's in this excellent book as well.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Amazons-Legends-Warrior-Ancient/dp/0691147205
Read up a little more before making assertions that people are dumb, it ends up making you look dumb...
I do hate that almost all the TIL's are wikipedia links though.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Highjump
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Swabia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_Glocke
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_Hapgood
https://www.amazon.com/Maps-Ancient-Sea-Kings-Civilization/dp/0932813429
The first two volumes of this series are for middle school:
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https://www.amazon.com/Human-Odyssey-Vol-Prehistory-Through/dp/1931728534/ref=sr_1_1?crid=13HH1NAQ6IPNG&keywords=human+odyssey+vol+1&qid=1556556024&s=gateway&sprefix=human+odyssey%2Caps%2C121&sr=8-1
​
I own the first two but have not used them yet. They LOOK good to me when I flip through them. Planning to use vol 2 this coming year - son will be 6th grade. It seems to be pretty well thought of in various homeschool groups. You can get a student book and teacher guide, but it was a little hard to find. I found a used set on thriftbooks.com. Seems to be online classes based around the books at k12.com. But that site is so confusing I couldn't figure out how the classes work. Think you might have to "enroll" in an online school.
I generally love Pandia Press's science. But I have seen multiple times in various facebook groups that their history is a lot of writing and busywork and my son has dysgraphia so I opted to kind of make my own modern history plan for next year. We're trying to get synced up with Build Your Library for 7th grade - discovered BYL a month ago and really like it.
​
Anyway, please note that both of my recommendations for and against things are mostly based on second hand opinions at this point until I actually start the Human Odyssey book in the fall.
​
EDIT: Pandia Press History Odyssey is on sale right now though, so maybe I will take a look at that too!
>I imagine a world where technological progress has been inhibited, and the world has been in a medieval state. (...)
In a "Medieval state", so, that can be summed up by much quicker technological advancement than either in Roman times or during the renaissance?
Medieval as in, religion had much less importance to civic life than in Rome (when religious festivals were a civic duty, which did put Christians at odds with traditions) and much less power than during the renaissance (when the papacy had regained independence from secular states)? a Church which basically is struggling to liberate itself from secular domination - until it did, at the very end of the middle ages, thanks to the Cluniac movement. A church that is the main driving engine of scientific progress (oh, this one will hurt some Redditors' head to no end.)
In short, a "middle ages" that would look nothing like the actual middle ages. This period was anything but low-tech or dominated by religion, and religious institutions such as the papacy and monasteries were incredibly important to scientific/technological progress. I wonder how much time before the public psyche catches up to historical research in this area. Because those views are totally at odds.
Sources:
Maybe they should read Into The Wild or read about hunter gathers back 20,000 years ago at the end of the last ice age and realize how much effort there is to truly living off the land.
Have a read of this book for a bit more info
http://www.amazon.com/After-Ice-Global-History-000-5000/dp/0674019997/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1211761944&sr=8-1
Not sure if it's exactly what you're looking for, but I enjoyed "Britain BC" by the (Time Team) archaeologist Francis Pryor. It's (obviously) biased towards the archaeology, rather than just discussing belief, but it's a good read.
https://www.amazon.com/Britain-BC-Ireland-Before-Romans/dp/000712693X
I'm reading this currently and loving it: https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/0674019997/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
>The Celts would have arrived in Britain around 800 BC, my years might be a bit off here but not by much. They would have spread upwards from England into Scotland and west from England/Wales across the sea to Ireland.
There is no evidence to support this at all.
In fact there is little evidence to support all that much in terms of Celtic culture arriving in Scotland. The linguistic evidence contradicts the archeological evidence, and DNA this far back proves nothing.
In addition to this... the Goidelic Celts which I assume are the 'Genetic Irish' in this article spread via 'Spain' and from 'Scotland' itself.
In short... this idea of aboriginal celts and their DNA is nonsense.
edit to add - This is a good read
I really enjoy reading Francis Pryor's "Britain BC"
http://www.amazon.com/Britain-BC-Ireland-Before-Romans/dp/000712693X
It covers a longer time-span than just the Bronze Age, but it is quite well written.
Just finished The Good Soldiers. A beautifully written and very moving account of US a Army Ranger battalion in Baghdad in 2007, during the 'surge'.
Halfway through After the Ice. A bit of paleontology / anthropology. Specifically about the era just pre-civilisation. That is when humanity was settling out of the hunter-gatherer lifestyle, and was tentatively domesticating plants and animals. Still prehistoric, as we have no writing from that era. (And they were almost certainly illiterate).
I don't read much fiction anymore because truth is stranger than fiction, but when I do, it's generally a classic of one sort or another.
I love my local library!
Pick up a copy of The Amazons: Lives and Legends of Warrior Women across the Ancient World. It might not be exactly what you're looking for, but it was really fascinating.
Thank you for the recommendation! There's a Kindle edition for $1.99 that I just got.
Yes, this map would/could be an anthology of then current, and even older maps.
Maps were traded and collected and copied and collated; roughly joined together, and then redrawn to make larger - albeit often more inaccurate - maps.
Maps of the Ancient Sea Kings: Evidence of Advanced Civilization in the Ice Age by Professor Charles H. Hapgood.
http://www.amazon.com/Maps-Ancient-Sea-Kings-Civilization/dp/0932813429
details pre-Columbian maps which accurately plot the eastern South American seaboard - and even more astonishingly - the Antartic coastline without it's present icefields!
Anyone care to glibly explain that away?
If you like a more general view of all ancient civilizations, I would recommend The Human Past: World Prehistory and the Development of Human Societies (https://www.amazon.com/Human-Past-Prehistory-Development-Societies/dp/0500290636).
I would also recommend 1177 B.C.: The Year Civilization collapsed as it gives a great view of how everything was connected.
If you are looking for something else, there is the list of excelent books from /r/AskHistorians (https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/wiki/books) or from /r/History (https://www.reddit.com/r/history/wiki/recommendedlist#wiki_the_classics)
Happy reading ;)
Why 37,000 years ago? That sounds like a rather specific age and suggests that you have a more specific question in mind. For example, are you interested in Homo sapiens/Neanderthal interactions? At that distant age, archaeologists find sites that give us snippets of behavior, rather than definitive knowledge of what everyday life was like, so your question would be hard to answer. I can say with some certainty though, that life would have been very different in different parts of the world during that time period. Modern humans were living throughout Africa, Asia, Europe, and Australia at that point, and each continent would require different adaptations.
My own research interests don't usually extend that far back in time, so I can't think of a good readable book detailing sites from 37,000 years ago. The best one I can recommend is After the Ice, which discusses how human life changes during the transition from the Pleistocene to the Holocene around the world.
Yes, I still spell "Neanderthal" with the "th." I'm stubborn like that. Just because the German spelling changes doesn't mean the English usage needs to follow suit, in my opinion.
The Amazons by Adrienne Mayor
No, that was just something the Greeks thought they did. See this awesome book for lots more. https://www.amazon.com/dp/0691170274
The second book of The Iliad mentions allies of Troy coming to swell Priam's ranks, starting on line 816. They list a diverse range of peoples as coming to Troy's aid - mostly other groups from Anatolia, where the Hittites would have ruled at the time, but also people from Scythia, Thrace, Macedonia, and from "far away". Historians debate how much of it is based on history or how much is later insertion, but Hittite sources reveal that Hittite forces fought the Greeks over the area around the same time, so the forces from Anatolia were historical. And the allies close to Troy were likely based on friendly Luwian neighbors. The others are more debatable.
A lost sequel to The Iliad, called The Aethiopis, detailed the arrival of large allied contingents led by Memnon and Penthesilea, intent on relieving Troy before they are defeated by Achilles. We mostly know of it from fragments and retellings, the most complete of which is from Quintus of Smyrna and can be read here.
Memnon was considered to be a historical Egyptian or Nubian king by ancient Western historians, but as history and our knowledge of Egyptian chronology advanced, the consensus became that he does not line up with any known kings. The wiki gives a good overview of his portrayal over time.
If we accept the ~1190-1184 BC dating for the Sack of Troy, then Memnon's expedition falls under either the reigns of Setnakhte or Ramesses III, the first two Pharaohs of the 20th Dynasty of New Kingdom Egypt. They were both known for being warrior kings, sending out military expeditions and driving out invasions of the Sea Peoples (which included Mycenaean Greeks). There's no hard evidence of Memnon's expedition, but putting the Greek account together with our records of these Pharaohs, I've talked to plenty of historians who think that the account of Memnon probably originated from an Egyptian relief force that arrived to oppose the "Sea Peoples".
Penthesilea, on the other hand, doesn't have much evidence. There's just the connection that Ancient Greeks are thought to have based their Amazon myths on encounters with Scythians, and Scythians are mentioned in the list of Trojan allies, so some historians think that Penthesilea and her Amazons might be a mythologized memory of the Scythian forces that came to aid Troy.
>For example, men have always been the ones tasked with dangerous occupations like hunting, fighting, as well as less obvious ones like leadership.
Women, on the other hand are almost always tasked with domestic duties of some sort and caring for the sick, elderly, and young.
While I don't disagree with you, I would be careful to make grand assumptions about historical gender roles like you did there. Here is some information that contradicts your assumption of pre-neolithic gender roles.
>In The Invisible Sex, the authors present an exciting new look at prehistory, arguing that women invented all kinds of critical materials, including the clothing necessary for life in colder climates, the ropes used to make rafts that enabled long-distance travel by water, and nets used for communal hunting.
Truth is, we still have a lot to learn about our ancient ancestor's social arrangements. There is a lot to still discover.
Read some of Graham Hancock's stuff. He has quite a few interviews on Youtube if you want to browse through them. When I have time, I'll find one where he discusses this and post a link. I've read several of his non-fiction books and he does excellent research on the material. FIngerprint of the gods is excellent, but Underworld is what I found most fascinating about stuff that existed 10,000+ years ago, who built it and what happened to them:
http://www.amazon.com/Underworld-The-Mysterious-Origins-Civilization/dp/1400049512/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1413657393&sr=8-1&keywords=graham+hancock+underworld
So you're looking for hundreds of pages of open-ended history? Sounds like a tall order for an NSQ question. :-)
You might enjoy this book.
I'm not familiar with that author, but this book by Bellah is a good one:
http://www.amazon.com/Religion-Human-Evolution-Paleolithic-Axial/dp/0674061438/ref=pd_sim_sbs_b_3
Also The Robert Bellah Reader. As a 'romantic' scholar of religion who is also an atheist I really like his work.
Happy reading!
Edit, paragraphs. :)
Whoops. Yes, you're right. Correct titles are:
Blackwell Companion to the Ancient Near East
http://www.amazon.com/Companion-Ancient-Near-East/dp/1405160012
Blackwell Companion to Archaeology of the Ancient Near East
http://www.amazon.com/Companion-Archaeology-Ancient-Near-East/dp/1405189886/ref=sr_1_8?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1465136494&sr=1-8&keywords=archaeology+ancient+near+east
The series titles get a bit blurry when you're writing them all in a Reddit post from memory.
I was absolutely fascinated by The Beginnings of Western Science: The European Scientific Tradition in Philosophical, Religious, and Institutional Context, Prehistory to A.D. 1450. It's considerably deeper than Bryson's book (which I also found to be fantastic), but it really covers a lot of fascinating material about the development of science.
> My main point is not, wah wah men had this bad or wah wah women had that bad. My point re patriarchy is that it's operating on the level of the social order. It's systemic.
Nope, the blame patriarchy is an utter myth. We don't live in a patriarchy at all. If anything it resembles more of a matriarchy than anything else: 1. women have majority vote, 2. special privileges, and support for women only, 3. millions of tax payer money goes to organizations for women who have radical leaders such as NOW and abuse it to wage an ongoing campaign against males and anything masculine 4. men bear all responsibly still 5. feminist myths such as the wage gap, 1 in 4 are rape myth 6. draft only for men 7. harsher sentences for male criminals and women who get away with a slap on the wrist 8. millions of single mothers and bastard children, 9. corrupt family courts who don't allow good fathers to see their kids. 10. consequent rise in youth crime and degradation of society 11. men who have significant shorter life expectations do most dirty work 12. far majority of homeless are men 13. little attention to men's issues by mass media.
> My point re women previously is that they didn't have full autonomy or the opportunity to operate independently of a male figure.
That's not true there's been colleges, universities for women exclusively as well. And "Roman women were allowed to own businesses among other "equal rights". Babylonian women had suffrage, child support, and alimony!"
> You're also not wrong when you say that in the past life was shit for everybody. My point though is that chivalry as you call it is an example of a patriarchal system.
No, chivalry arose due to the preferences for men and women to do certain types of work. Women didn't want to risk their lives such as: slaying beasts in the wilderness, or do battles so men were shamed into doing so by their wives, and families. Keep in mind in a long time ago it was a very different world than it is today. It's men who tamed the world for women.
Chivalry is in no-way patriachal. Chivalry is an attempt to make nice to women. Women were the ones interpreting this as imposing dependence on men. For example when a husband opens the door for his wife, he lets her through because she deserves it.
Chivalry was merely men protecting women on behalf of other men....it was necessary to protect women when the world was much tougher.
Also see:
> For decades, Gloria Steinem, Riane Eisler, Marija Gimbutas and other feminist authors have painted a picture of a golden age before the onset of patriarchy, a time when women ruled the earth, and all the world worshipped the Goddess. This bold and provocative book marshals archeological evidence to demonstrate that this gynocentric vision is a myth, and a pernicious one at that. Eller acknowledges that some women find the myth of matriarchal prehistory empowering but insists that it ultimately undermines genuine reform. A myth, she points out, is a weak foundation for a social movement. More to the point, gynocentric myths, she says, perpetuate the same stereotypical notions of femininity that have always served as tools of sexist oppression. Celebrating the positive virtues of motherhood, relationality, embodiedness and ecocentrism as universal feminine traits obscures genuine differences among women and limits female autonomy; as the saying goes, a pedestal is as confining as any small place. Eller's previous book, Living in the Lap of the Goddess: The Feminist Spirituality Movement in America, sympathetically described women's spiritual quests for self-validation and empowerment. Her new work affirms these goals while cautioning feminists against letting their fantasies about a past matriarchy distract them from taking real steps to end patriarchy today. Passionately argued, engagingly written, this vital book is certain to inspire wide--and much-needed--debate. (Apr.)
Copyright 2000 Reed Business Information, Inc. --This text refers to an out of print or unavailable edition of this title.
http://www.amazon.com/Myth-Matriarchal-Prehistory-Invented-Future/dp/0807067938/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1318852970&sr=1-1
> I've already waded through the front page of this sub and I've seen grievances against men by women (some real, some imagined), misguided bullshit, and just a smidge of informed content.
No, most content here are genuine issues. The whole list of men's issues that you commented on, are Facts that you can look up. This is my last reply to you for I have better things to do sorry.
Britain BC: life in Britain and Ireland before the Romans.
http://www.amazon.com/Religion-Human-Evolution-Paleolithic-Axial/dp/0674061438/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1405903928&sr=8-1&keywords=bellah+religion+in+human+evolution
The Horse, the Wheel and Language is a really excellent book about the origins of the Indo-european peoples. Did you ever wonder why so many of our ancient gods were sky and/or thunder gods? Why Iranian, English and Norse are all one big language family?
I also love After the Ice. That's another approachable archaeology/prehistory book. The author does an amazing job of imagining what life was like as the great sheets of ice retreated and humans began to settle in villages. Just imagine the changes in how people saw their world as they gave up tens of thousands of years of wandering to settle in one place and learn how to coax a living out of the land.
Quite possibly yes. *gaelic or pictish
Further reading. I actually spoke here on Reddit to an anthropologist working on this island and he read this book after I recommended it and acknowledged that he has to agree this is the best evidence and explanation he's heard for the questions posed by their research
https://www.amazon.com/Mystery-Skara-Brae-Neolithic-Scotland/dp/1620555735
I would say your intuitive thoughts are probably pretty spot on. You might find this book by Graham Handcock to be an interesting read. I know I did. :-)
I fancy myself a bit of an amazon so I am an infantry grunt (although they were really horsewomen if you haven't read it: https://www.amazon.com/Amazons-Legends-Warrior-across-Ancient/dp/0691170274/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1466811407&sr=8-1&keywords=The+Amazons), so I am half of a .50 cal MG team. I carry the tripod and the optics to spot. Since our other girl is new and is crazy about firing the biggest things she can get her hands on (so we prefer to have me handle security since I can drop a moving target at 600m with an M16).
> Science. Religion has been fighting it for thousands of years.
I'm afraid that to even assume that science and religion existed as distinct concepts or endeavours thousands of years ago is a bit naïve, and this idea that they are eternally opposed is a very simplistic view that reflects the biases of anticlerical 19th Century historians more than the actual facts—it's only really been defended by people with a grudge against religion since a reappraisal of the subject in the 1950s, 60s, and 70s (and especially since the reappraisal by James Moore in The Post-Darwinian Controversies). Here are a few books that could help you develop a richer understanding of the historical relationship between science and religion.
These would probably be illuminating reading as well.
> Here is just another surrender by a guy at the top of the money chain.
No one interested in the subject should be under the impression that what the Pope has said is anything new. Eminent Catholic theologians like John Henry Newman found Darwin's theory of natural selection consistent with Christianity when it was published, and Pope Pius XII very famously affirmed that there was no intrinsic conflict between them in his 1950 encyclical Humani generis. As for the Big Bang, it is downright foolish to characterise the Church as "surrendering" to a theory that was formulated by a Catholic priest in the first place.